[OT] 9/11 Pentagon Strike

[Pierino]

Just found an interesting (and I think very nicely done) shockwave animation regarding the pentagon strike on 9/11:

http://www.pentagonstrike.co.uk/pentagon.swf

I don't want to get political. I just wonder, why certain things always remain unsolved (all over the world, not just in the USA!) and (almost) nobody
seems to care about.

And I'm interested in the opinion of real world pilots. Do you think it's really possible that a B 757 hit the pentagon?

Cheers

Pierino

[pagir]

"Please all stay calm, remain seated, turbulence to come..."

Pagir

[jboweruk]

Best to lock this thread before it gets out of hand.... And believe me it will

[SaVas]

There are a number of opinions, and whether I agree or disagree with what hit the pentagon, I will keep my opinion to myself.

The 9/11 disaster is in the past where I personally wish to keep it. I dont dwell on it, however will never forget it either, and with saying
such, I look toward the future knowing the world in which I live as an adult of 35 years of age, is a far different world than it was when I
was a child.

[Dutch64]

The poster won't have any bad intentions for sure but this thread *will* get political and emotional for sure. Maybe this forum is not the best place
to keep a topic like this. Just my humble opinion.

[Pierino]

I understand all of your postings very well. I was afraid to post the link by the reasons you mention.

But what really p***es me off is the fact that obviously everybody seems to think "The 9/11 disaster is in the past where I personally wish to keep it".

How comes that the whole world population somehow doesn't have the right anymore to know what's going on?
While e.g. young Germans are still beeing blamed for the sins their grandfathers did 60 years ago.

You expressed this perfectly SaVas:

I look toward the future knowing the world in which I live as an adult of 35 years of age, is a far different world than it was when I
was a child.

I'm 35 years old too and exactly feel the same.
It's a sad sad world!

And this is a great forum, so feel free to close this thread anytime you want.

Let's close our mouth, eyes and ears, and let'em take us for a ride!


Pierino

[pagir]

All of that will change when Past will become History...

4 years is not so long. Many persons don't want to or just can't see all this sad moments because it's too soon to get a good perspective
view. It's not about closing mouth, eyes and ears, it's more about you can't see the forest when you're in it. In French, we say that the tree
is hiding the forest.

I don't wont to close this thread now, just because not everybody has the chance to express their views.

And if you want my personnal opinion about this 757 in the Pentagon. I can't imagine how bad are the people who killed so many people.
No matter who they are. But I can't imagine either how this could be a "conspiration". But I didn't see any plane there. But maybe the
explosion was too big...

History will answer those question. We should remain vigilant, though...

Pagir

[Capt. Wotan]

I agree with Pagir, why close the thread, most of the people here are adults, i'm pretty sure we can express our views while keeping in mind that many
people lost there lives that day, regardless of how.

It's certainly interesting that there is no wreckage, did they ever find wreakage of the tower impacts though? I imagine that a plane could be
destroyed completely and of course it isn't just the weight of the plane, but the mass when the speed is taken into account, even a light object at
high speed can cause massive damage and can disintegrate in the process.

[SaVas]

Throughout time there have always been disasters of a natural making, to man-made, to influenced by humankind, many of which are
the act of cowardly individuals, or those who have "divine inspiration", to acts of governments. There always will be sadly, and I for one
feel as the world becomes even more grossly over-populated, they will become more numerous & more deadly.

Did a Boeing hit the Pentagon? I dont know as I wasnt there and can only determine my thoughts on it by the evidence I have seen in the
media or online. All I know is it happened, and I saw something in my lifetime I had hoped never to see and while I look at it as the past, I
will forever envision it as if it were happening now, still in disbelief.

[Pierino]

Thanks Pagir, great post.

I wouldn't have ever expected less, great forum as I said!

My intention of the original post was to "technically" discuss the question whether a B 757 hit the pentagon or not.
There were several discussions about plane crashes here before. But by remembering now that even they lead to goony "political" statements (like
"Cyprus is a thirld world country" and similar) and the therefore inevitable discussions I understand that 9/11 is too explosive a topic to discuss
even one tiny detail (we can call a B 757 tiny, can't we?) of it.

I'm glad to know there are other old-fashioned thinkers out there.

Cheers!

Pierino

[Pierino]

and can disintegrate in the process.

maybe this could've been "accelerated" by the specfic construction of the walls?

But a whole B757 including pax and cargo?

hmmm

[Capt. Wotan]

...Actually pieces of plane where found at the pentagon site, but none of them had any serial numbers. They found a part of the nose cone, it looked
like it had been quite cleanly taken off with a shearing force, there was no compression or fire damage visable.

[Pierino]

for those who are interested, a "Physical and mathematical analysis of Pentagon crash by Gerard Holmgren":

http://www.thewebfairy.com/911/holmgren/index.html (sorry for the music!)

p

[nem]

I admit that I haven't followed the links in this thread, but I guess I've dealt enough with what happened and the investigations (and
theories) that followed to form a personal opinion. There are lots of elaborate theories about this plane crash "mystery", there are also
very reasonable and sensible analysises that show why there of course was a plane crash.

Personally I go with the latter.

Personally I also think what actually happened is (don't take this cynically) pretty much unimportant in the end.

Great tragedies like 9/11 are always very grievous for a comparatively (compared to world population ) small group of people (those
directly affected, their families and friends). For the rest of the world they very soon seem to become something like a morbid hobby for
discussions, political agitations, conspiracy theories, a good reason to openly show more or less honestly felt sympathy and sorrow,
and generally a great topic to get worked up over. Don't get me wrong on this. I don't want to disturb the feelings of any person anywhere
in the world who honestly feels sorrow or whatever because of this or other great disasters in the world.

I just can't stop the feeling that the mentioned honesty is lacking in many cases.

Anyway, what it comes down to is this: either tragedies like 9/11 are arbitrary and senseless; or there IS some deeper raeson for them.
In the first case they are just what they appear to be - horrible desasters. In the latter case they are what many people seem to treat them
as - smoke and mirrors.

And you can't look through a sorcerer's smoke and mirrors by staring real hard at them, you have to try to grasp the things you can't
see, the things you can (at best) deduct by logical thinking. And not by thinking about the smoke and mirrors itself either, but by thinking
about what the sorcerer wants to achieve and how and why he might have achieved it. You don't bother with the details to see through
the trick.

Therefore if there REALLY was a plane crashing into the Pentagon (again, I think there was), if the Twin Towers REALLY collapsed by
the help of two planes alone, if Osama REALLY motivated this or if Elvis REALLY is still alive doesn't matter to me. These are just details
(again, don't take this cynical, apologies to anyone who might be offended by this view) which either popped up arbitrary because there
is just no hidden motivation to what happened, or which were created on purpose so the majority of people can do what they most like to
do (and what we are doing right now): play with the details and not start to actually think about something REALLY important.

What counts is what you think is behind it, if you think there's anything behind it at all.

Just my $0.02.

[alphaone]

Ok, I see the reports, I see the "evidence" if you can call it that. But I have just one question if it wasn't a 757 that hit the pentagon...

what in the hell happened to AA flight 77 then???

757's just don't disappear.

They note that in the security camera shots it looks like a small plane hitting the pentagon. But they fail to note the relative size of a 757 vs the pentagon. The pentagon is 77 ft tall. A 757's tail is 44ft tall. That's a difference of 33ft. And from the 5 frames that are released, in the first frame you can clearly see the tail of the plane coming in. And the porportions look about right for it to be a 757. And if a plane weighing about 250,000lbs going 530mph hits a solid object, with loads more mass than the plane has, built with steel, reinforced concrete and limestone walls, there is not going to be much of the plane left to find. Its basic physics.



Post Edited ( 09-17-05 08:35 )