[Closed] What Happened to

[timtomairways]

i would jusy like to oint out that searching for even more complex stuff is not hard

just last night, i wanted to know how to convert climb gradient into climb rate
i really did not even know it was called climb cradient i just slimply typed in
"how do i know how fast i am climbing per notical mile"

and the links broght me to a very helpfull page

in fact it has alot of answers to alot of questions on it. ( http://www.scenery.org/faq_aviation.htm )

i could have simply posted the question here. i dont think it has been asled before, but i do have sense enough to search on my own first

im sorry if i offend any one (not really) but im just going to say it for what it is

[Wreck1463]

I would like to jump in on the defense of some newbies....
I'm a real world Pilot in business jets, but there are a lot of questions I have that I might not be able to search for in a specific forum.
Sometimes asking things like "what's KTAS" are hard to find, because people on THIS forum might not have used that acronym...etc.
Sometimes frustration leads to big long posts flaming the newbie, rather than a simple "google Knots True Airspeed".....
Just my .02

[Drew]

Surely they shouldn't need to be told to google for it? That should be their first port of call, before thinking about posting on a forum.

Main problem is people won't help themselves, instead prefering to post on a forum and let someone else do the work for them.



Post Edited ( 01-10-10 10:04 )

[Wreck1463]

I wasn't clear....
I mean there might be a question someone has about a concept, and they have no idea what the terminology pilots use to discuss that
concept is. I fully realize this isn't always the case, but I've seen examples such as this on many forums, including this one, where people
get blasted for asking questions. My point is, it's just as easy to say go google the term "blah blah blah", rather than complain that they
haven't done enough searching on their own. I understand the mod's and the program authors frustrations at simple questions being
asked over and over again, but they should also realize that people on this forum have paid money for FSP, and expect to find help here.
PS...I haven't had any problem on this forum, and love the program.

[Recon]

Wreck1463 wrote:
I understand the mod's and the program authors frustrations at simple questions being
asked over and over again, but they should also realize that people on this forum have paid money for FSP, and expect to find help here.
PS...I haven't had any problem on this forum, and love the program.

True...but in a lot of cases people are inpatience to look for a answer.
And every forum has a FAQ and a search function.
And with a little common sense that's the first place to look.
Also a lot of questions are about basic flying knowledge that has nothing to do with FsP.
And we get also alot of threads about things that you can find in the help guide....
What i mean that it is possible that you read over it and didn't saw it that happens sometimes.
But the most answer can be found in the FAQ, via the searchfunction or in the guide.
And then it can occur that the get a response that is not that proffesional but he....are we all not humans????
To come to the point.......if you know how to open a thread then usally you know how to read, so in that case you CAN look at the FAQ and
can use the search function.
This is my opion about it and let's respect eachothers opion.

Best Regards,

[stweaver321]

Great discussion here!

Point 1 - If you are someone who is bothered by people asking "dumb" questions, then just don't respond to the thread. There WILL be others who don't
mind answering those types of questions and they will post helpful responses.

Point 2 - This still boils down to customer support. Customers ask dumb questions all the time for all types of products and services. In order to
gain business, companies still have to treat these people with kindness and respect. It's in the company's interest to do so.

Point 3 - Currently, FSP stands alone in it's product offering (there are no other similar programs as good). What if somebody else comes
along...customer support will be one of the distinguishing factors--good or bad.

[Recon]

stweaver321 wrote:
Great discussion here!

Point 1 - If you are someone who is bothered by people asking "dumb" questions, then just don't respond to the thread. There
WILL be others who don't
mind answering those types of questions and they will post helpful responses.

Point 2 - This still boils down to customer support. Customers ask dumb questions all the time for all types of products and services. In
order to
gain business, companies still have to treat these people with kindness and respect. It's in the company's interest to do so.

Point 3 - Currently, FSP stands alone in it's product offering (there are no other similar programs as good). What if somebody else comes
along...customer support will be one of the distinguishing factors--good or bad.

Yep
Point 1 - dumb questions will be there allways on any forum, but I respond on that by giving them or the link to the thread and point out to
them that next them they can look first at the FAQ/search function/ guide.

Point 2/3 - How far you want to let the customer support go....? There is good forum with a FAQ and there is a guide with the program.
It is normal to first point at the FAQ/guide and if they have after that still a question, you're more then welcome to ask.
Why do you think allmost every product/company has a FAQ and a guide???? To save time answering question that are asked allways.
And you cannot compare a one man show with a view dedicated MOD's with a big company with customersupport 24/7 who get payed to
do so.
Yes it is still a product you pay for and you still can have support (what is not a lawfull right btw)
But that doesn't take away that you can look first for youself.
It is not high sience to look at a FAQ or use a search function.
If you buy a car, oke not everybody has a technical background to look or identify the problem.
But if you can open a thread you are also able to look at a forum and therefor also able to look at the FAQ/search function.
This saves time for everybody including the person who is searching for a quick answer.
I can agree though by expanding the FAQ with a view more freqently asked questions.

[stweaver321]

Recon wrote:
How far you want to let the customer support go....?

That's a question that Dan needs to answer since this is his company.

Recon wrote:
There is good forum with a FAQ and there is a guide with the program.
It is normal to first point at the FAQ/guide and if they have after that still a question, you're more then welcome to ask.
Why do you think allmost every product/company has a FAQ and a guide???? To save time answering question that are asked allways.
And you cannot compare a one man show with a view dedicated MOD's with a big company with customersupport 24/7 who get payed to
do so.
Yes it is still a product you pay for and you still can have support (what is not a lawfull right btw)
But that doesn't take away that you can look first for youself.
It is not high sience to look at a FAQ or use a search function.
If you buy a car, oke not everybody has a technical background to look or identify the problem.
But if you can open a thread you are also able to look at a forum and therefor also able to look at the FAQ/search function.
This saves time for everybody including the person who is searching for a quick answer.
I can agree though by expanding the FAQ with a view more freqently asked questions.

The point of my post is that customers deserve to be treated with respect. I've seen quite a few derogatory responses to customers who are just
trying to get a problem solved and enjoy their new FSP purchase.

Sure, it makes sense for customers to check FAQs and other posts...that's not being debated. However, if someone chooses to post a new forum question
when they could have just searched for an answer then they should still be treated with respect. You can respectfully ask that someone refer to a FAQ
or other forum post without insulting them...nothing wrong with that and I haven't suggested that there is. Ultimately, you do not even have to
respond to a person's dumb question if it bothers you.

Yes, customers should follow forum rules in order to ensure timely support, but it is not the job of other forum members or even of FSP mods to
verbally pound customers into submission. I believe there's quite a bit that could be done with these forums to make them more usable, which is a
better way to get people to follow the rules anyway.

[Recon]

Yes, customers should follow forum rules in order to ensure timely support, but it is not the job of other forum members or even of FSP
mods to
verbally pound customers into submission. I believe there's quite a bit that could be done with these forums to make them more usable,
which is a
better way to get people to follow the rules anyway.

I'd never saw on this forum that happening.
That a person asks a question and he is getting pound by other members/Mod's.
What I did saw was that "new" members on their first post started to scream and shout a lot of negative things...Well of course you get
then a reaction back....action-reaction.
If you call to a company and when the company picks up the phone and you start to honk your horn right away,.....you think they will treat
you nice and calm,...no they ask if you can stay calm and speak polied(sorry dont know how to write the word ).
And if you still are going on even after a view request from the other person to stay calm...then yes they hang up the phone.

But anyway,.......i did not see here on the forum the "new" members get pound by members/Mod's,......unless they specific asked for it

[AeroJim]

Actually yes, no matter how a customer asks you treat them with respect and stay calm. The most loyal customer is often the customer who had an issue
with a company and the company helped resolve it to the customer's satisfaction. I hope if you do work for a company when a customer calls to
complain you don't shoot them down and hang up on them, you're losing your company a lot of revenue.

[Recon]

AeroJim wrote:
Actually yes, no matter how a customer asks you treat them with respect and stay calm. The most loyal customer is often the customer
who had an issue
with a company and the company helped resolve it to the customer's satisfaction. I hope if you do work for a company when a customer
calls to
complain you don't shoot them down and hang up on them, you're losing your company a lot of revenue.

Then you misunderstand me (probarly because of my fantastic English )
Again......oke let's do it like this:
You are the customer and I am the company.
You call me because there is something wrong with product or whatever.
So I pick up the phone hello blablabla....and then you start to shout and scream at me......
Till this point i have no idear what is the matter you are just shouting that everything is crap en **** and blablabla.
Well I ask you then to stay calm and explain what is the problem.....and what do you do shout and scream some more that everything is
**** and crap.
Again I ask you in a nice way to stay calm and polied....and still you keep on going....
Well who has here now disrespect for who...............please explain me that.....what gives the customer the god given right to yell and
scream and show his emotion all the way and the other person,...me in this example has to shut up and listen and stay polied....
We are all humans and we all breath the same air and we all deserve the same kind of respect !!!!!!!!
And if I after a view times ask you to stay calm and you keep on going i deserve to keep my dignity and respect and i can hang up the
phone.
And here on the forum as you know to it isn't like that, that a "new" member gets pound when he is asking "dumb question.
But it did happend that a "new" member was shouting and screaming in his first post, and when other members/Mod's ask to stay calm
and polied and that person goes on yes then he is getting pound and with a reason........treat other people like you want to be treatend.
Because it happend also that a new member first was shouting and screaming and when him was told to stay calm he was calm and
they helpt him very good.
It is a 2-way traffic.

[whiskey-zulu]

This is related to this topic:

I have been browsing various other Flight Sim related websites and forums and FS Passengers' Forum has been mentioned a few times - nothing to
do with crap customer service or whatever - but the point is it isn't only registered members who read these posts. Looking through one
particular site this morning, I found a particularly prominent reference to this site on a problem that does/will affect a number of flight simulator
users; the problem was to do with the CTD with Vista and one of their updates. Now I have no idea whether the person who posted that piece on that
site is a member of this forum - fact is that that doesn't matter - what matters is that the name of this forum is out there and we should be aware of
that.

Topics like this, although they to bring peoples' thoughts out, can also give the site a bad name, especially amongst a community that, in general,
talks alot!

[stweaver321]

The fact that the FS Community talks a lot is a key reason why you should treat customers well.

Anyway, I think the point has been made and it sounds like there's at least a fair amount of consensus in here.

Here's to a friendly, positive forum!!

[Recon]

stweaver321 wrote:
The fact that the FS Community talks a lot is a key reason why you should treat customers well.

Anyway, I think the point has been made and it sounds like there's at least a fair amount of consensus in here.

Here's to a friendly, positive forum!!

Cheers

[Powerke]

I used to love FSP ...and i admire Dan for the awesome addon he created.
Its not perfect ...and this forum used to be a place where you could talk about issues with the software.

But the situation has changed in the last 2 years ....and that has made me stop with Flight sim and FSP.

For an easy example ....the way the mods react to the tire blowing issue , is just wrong.
It started with advise...and that i can only applaud...but now this issue has been reduce to a taboo ,
and i have seen several topics about that closed.

With answers like learn to fly and land ....working as intended and you payed for the software as is.

I myself dont have to much problems with a tire blowing from time to time.....even when the decent rate is
so low a tire should NOT blow.
Loads of freeware planes have problems with that and i have had tires blown with decent speeds as low as 170 fpm.

Even if ppl ask for a date about the upcomming patch that Dan is working on the responses are not what i call friendly.
So after i had seen another one of those topics.....with the usual answers of the mods and established simmers...
i desided to call it quits for me.!!

Maybe i will pop back in after Dan has released his patch.....and the attitude in this forum has changed.
But for now ...

No thank you.